From 634dee9380352d196537f900f9878d3528269e21 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: muflax Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2012 02:40:04 +0200 Subject: [PATCH] willpower draft --- .../status/conspiracy_theory_of_willpower.mkd | 61 +++++++++++++++++++ 1 file changed, 61 insertions(+) create mode 100644 content_blog/status/conspiracy_theory_of_willpower.mkd diff --git a/content_blog/status/conspiracy_theory_of_willpower.mkd b/content_blog/status/conspiracy_theory_of_willpower.mkd new file mode 100644 index 0000000..b94c5f0 --- /dev/null +++ b/content_blog/status/conspiracy_theory_of_willpower.mkd @@ -0,0 +1,61 @@ +--- +title: The Conspiracy Theory of Willpower +date: 2012-08-24 +techne: :wip +episteme: :speculation +--- + +(13時31分03秒) Owen Richardson: it's not a matter of running out of fuel +(13時31分16秒) Owen Richardson: because they can go farther if you raise the value of getting there +(13時31分49秒) 私: Another thing is that framing affects how draining a task is. Again, that seems more about what you're willing to invest in certain social interactions (as in, you're only worth 10min of my effort), than running out of willpower. +(13時31分57秒) Owen Richardson: glucose (or whatever) isn't being burned up +(13時32分48秒) Owen Richardson: but... hold on, I almost feel like I've got this down in terms of simple behaviorism +(13時33分59秒) Owen Richardson: there isn't a finite supply of "fuel", cuz people go farther if you motivate them by taking away excuses... +(13時34分10秒) Owen Richardson: raise the value of getting there +(13時35分21秒) Owen Richardson: you could say there's a throttle... to maintain as low a payoff/effort level as possible? +(13時36分21秒) Owen Richardson: but +(13時36分25秒) Owen Richardson: you could just say +(13時36分51秒) Owen Richardson: okay, here're the people who you told "you can't eat these cookies; have the radishes instead" +(13時36分57秒) Owen Richardson: they controlled themselves +(13時37分00秒) 私: I'm not sure "effort" is the right way of framing it. More like "time investment, according to social importance". +(13時37分04秒) Owen Richardson: they got squat for it +(13時37分29秒) 私: Right, you screwed them over, they won't cooperate as much in the next task. +(13時37分36秒) Owen Richardson: the learned that controlling yourself doesn't pay +(13時37分50秒) Owen Richardson: simple operant conditioning +(13時38分26秒) Owen Richardson: "time investment, according to social importance"? +(13時38分50秒) Owen Richardson: I bet they'd still do it even if no one saw +(13時38分57秒) Owen Richardson: self image +(13時39分13秒) Owen Richardson: but I wouldn't be surprised if a bit less, I guess... +(13時39分26秒) Owen Richardson: but yeah +(13時40分04秒) Owen Richardson: what else can we do with plain ol operant conditioning as a model? +(13時40分28秒) 私: So what? They still know you put the radish there. Whoever is running the experiment is still an ass. :) +(13時41分53秒) Owen Richardson: "still do it" meaning as the "it", putting in extra effort if made to believe they could choose to regenerate will power +(13時42分17秒) Owen Richardson: fuck eating the radishes if no one's watching XD +(13時42分27秒) 私: :D +(13時43分10秒) Owen Richardson: actually, personally, I'd probably eat all the cookies AND all the radishes +(13時43分17秒) 私: That should be testable, though. "Here are two dishes, choose one, no one's watching, we'd prefer if you don't eat the cookies". +(13時43分53秒) 私: vs. "you're supposed to eat the radish, but hey, I smuggled in some cookies, your choice, no one will know". +(13時44分35秒) Owen Richardson: I don't know what you expect to learn from that :P +(13時45分30秒) 私: As in, the less adverserial you make the experiment, the less depletion of willpower you should see. +(13時45分42秒) 私: Even if you do exactly the same thing and believe the same things. +(13時46分15秒) Owen Richardson: it seems like a test of how much people will be influenced by very weak suggestions that they should pick radishes over cookies? +(13時46分39秒) Owen Richardson: even when told "your choice, no one will know" +(13時47分07秒) Owen Richardson: "but you SHOULD, in some vague way, for some reason, eat the radishes" +(13時47分41秒) Owen Richardson: and then you puzzlefuck them +(13時47分45秒) Owen Richardson: what's the point? +(13時48分18秒) 私: What I mean is, willpower experiments have controlled how difficult tasks are, and what subjects believe. They haven't controlled how much they ally themselves with the experimenters. +(13時48分49秒) 私: As in, mysteriously becoming tired has nothing to do with the task at hand, but how much you are willing to associate with the experimenters. +(13時49分11秒) Owen Richardson: ...social... obligations' effect on "willpower", you mean? +(13時49分42秒) Owen Richardson: I forget how and why the radish cookie thing was presented +(13時49分44秒) 私: Let's call it the Conspiracy Theory of Willpower. :) +(13時49分57秒) Owen Richardson: but I thought it was tricksie +(13時50分17秒) Owen Richardson: like they were told it was a nutrition test or something +(13時50分47秒) Owen Richardson: and then whisked off the the impossible puzzles as a completely different experiment with different researchers +(13時51分14秒) Owen Richardson: "yeah, turns out the radish cookie guys couldn't make it. WHAT A SHAME." +(13時51分28秒) Owen Richardson: that's the kind of shit they pull +(13時51分52秒) 私: Hm. I'll have to check the papers. +(13時52分01秒) Owen Richardson: but yeah +(13時52分08秒) 私: I'll put it on my todo. :) +(13時52分11秒) Owen Richardson: operant conditioning +(13時52分51秒) 私: (Besides, there doesn't have to be just one explanation.) +(13時53分02秒) 私: Conditioning is definitely a thing.